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PostSubject: Fixture Proposals and Gradings   Thu Jan 17, 2013 2:35 am

Happy New Year girls and whatever boys are involved here.

What do you all think of the fixture proposa;s and gradings that have been released for the year ahead? Are clubs going to take time to work on these and return to the CB or are they just happy to accept whats been sent out?
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kelf
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PostSubject: Re: Fixture Proposals and Gradings   Thu Jan 17, 2013 4:03 am


Are there any big changes ??

Are the Leagues totally based on the 2012 League tables, except for any extra team ?

I did not notice anything unusual in the Senior/Inter/Junior.


The only thing I noticed was Grange seem to be gone, 2 clubs have "second" teams and in Under Age, despite it being on Hogan Stand that Rheban intended to have teams in most competitions they are not included.

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SeeTheStars
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PostSubject: Re: Fixture Proposals and Gradings   Tue Jan 22, 2013 4:27 am

These are only proposals, it's up to the clubs to come up with different ideas if they can make it fit around Leinster/Feile etc. There isn't a lot of slack in the schedule. One thing I would like to see is better communication with the Camogie board, a number of competitions were disrupted last year and the previous year due to clashes with Camogie.
Have it from a good source that Rheban will feature in the underage competitions in 2013-a welcome addition.
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kelf
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PostSubject: Re: Fixture Proposals and Gradings   Tue Jan 22, 2013 10:09 am



Rheban notes on Hogan Stand have indicated that they will field a number of Under Age teams.
They have been writing up Under Age training for some months. Be great to see another club getting into the groove.

Proposals were probably based on last year's teams as the Entry Form was sent out with the proposals so there might be a few additions.
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Kildare Castle
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PostSubject: Re: Fixture Proposals and Gradings   Thu Jan 24, 2013 6:36 am

Rheban are entering Girls U10s right up to u16 there has been a great response to the Girls football ,so hopefully it will continue to gain momentum,Great work being done by the Ladies Section to encourage more girls into football.
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PostSubject: Re: Fixture Proposals and Gradings   Thu Jan 24, 2013 10:53 am

Kildare Castle

That's great to hear. Credit to all involved.
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PostSubject: Re: Fixture Proposals and Gradings   Thu Jan 24, 2013 8:45 pm

Best of luck to Rheban with their underage. Hpe it goes well for them.

With regard to the fixtures, there are some serious bad grading going on with the divisions. I know most people wont care because its in the lower divisions, but how can Rheban be in Junior D after contesting last years final? Same goes for Celbridge. Beaten by Monasterevan in last years junior C final and now they're back in junior C for another year. Athgarvan the exact same. Has there been a change in the rules? If so - then Im wrong and I apologise.

Theres very little consitency in the leagues either. Ballykelly hardly played a game in last years league, let alone won one. So why are they still in Division 2? Round Towers won Division 5 of the league only 2 years ago, now they're back in Division 5. Hardly fair on the new teams or second teams down there.
Why can't the county board just stick to the 2 promoted and 1 relegated agreement that was reached a couple of years ago?

As for the fixtures. Theres no minor fixtures planned until the proposed start in June, then ends in October with 1 game a month.
Minor is the hardest age group to get girls to commit to. THE biggest area for drop offs. And June is THE WORST time for getting young girls available to play. We have nothing in the fixture calander for Jan, Feb or March - except county training and matches. Why can't the minor championship be played then?

I fully appreciate that the fixtures calander can be congested and can be hard to find days for matches. But leaving 3 months at the start of the year - where minor is normally played - is crazy stuff.
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kelf
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PostSubject: Re: Fixture Proposals and Gradings   Fri Jan 25, 2013 3:33 am


Championships: Winners are automatically promoted. The idea of Runners-Up also being promoted was introduced in recent years, as part of Dev Plan, I believe and may have had a time span or until certain numbers were reached at each level. Then again it may still be in force and an error in the proposals ?

As for the Leagues: A look at the final Tables from last year would be a necessity before i could make a reasonable comment. Any one have those tables ?

Minor in the Spring sounds good. Have schools sorted out the "Mocks" to all have them the same week, as mocks, Practicals & Orals, spread out from Jan to May can be a mess for both U16 & Minor (or are they just used as excuses ?).

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PostSubject: Re: Fixture Proposals and Gradings   Sat Jan 26, 2013 9:50 am

Whitelass. need to correct you on one point Ballykelly played ALL their games in the league last year, THEY received 3 walkovers, 2 from the one club.

As has been pointed out these are proposed gradings based on last years finishing positions, am sure there will be plenty of clubs looking to drop down and very few looking to go up

Minor was tried last spring and was a disaster, a lot of clubs depend on u16 to make up minor and playing both at the same time along with it clashing with mocks and leaving cert study did not work,

The development plan if fully implemented would have worked but it wasn't, the intermediate championship is a mess because of this. In my opinion there are to many championship grades with far too many clubs always looking to drop. I hear there is now a senior club looking to come down
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PostSubject: Re: Fixture Proposals and Gradings   Sat Jan 26, 2013 10:32 pm

Apologies there Ballyboy, but the last table I saw, your girls were bottom of Div 2. Obviously that wasnt an up to date table. So did the points accumulated from the 3 walkovers keep you in Div 2?

There are always clubs looking to drop down. Sarsfields are forever at it. I too heard that a senior club are looking to come down. Eadestown, who pulled players in from all over the country to 'win' and All-Ireland only a few years ago are now looking to drop down. I assume they will be told where to go. Or is that too much to hope?

I remember attending meetings in the Westgrove a few years ago, where it was proposed to reduce the amount of championship divisions. Some clubs would have found themselves being moved up a level, but it had the support of any of the people I spoke with at the time. God only knows why that plan was never implemented.

As for minor football. It has been played in Spring for a long time now. In fact I can remember playing minor football in Feb and March - and I can assure you that wasnt today or yesterday. I can also recall it being tried in the Summer a few years ago and it was a total disaster with little or no clubs entering.
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kelf
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PostSubject: Re: Fixture Proposals and Gradings   Sun Jan 27, 2013 12:30 am



I see that for the League the proposal is for 6 teams in the top 4 divs & 10 (apprx) in Div 5.

Would 7 in DIV 4 & 8 in DIV 5 not be a better solution ??

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ballyboy
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PostSubject: Re: Fixture Proposals and Gradings   Sun Jan 27, 2013 8:17 am

Minor football is a problem no matter when you play it, a lot of girls drop out after 16's, early in the year you have the problems mention above, during the summer you have holidays plus the fact that the best of them will be playing on most clubs adult team. There always seems to be an argument about when it shouldn't be played but none have come up with a solution. Bottom line is while clubs want to put out minor teams, players don't seem to be to pushed and that is the main problem in any club I've spoken too.

Your assumption about our final league position is correct but aside from that there was no relegation from 1 and 2 last year because of the demise of Grange which left a gap in the top 2 divisions

I think the leagues are fine but the championship has far to many grades, 4 would be enough imo with a shield final in each for the bottom half and a relegation final for the bottom 2
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PostSubject: Re: Fixture Proposals and Gradings   Tue Jan 29, 2013 9:52 pm

The leagues just need to be started a couple of weeks earlier. Waiting til March is mad, especially when there's a month break at the end to the final because of exams, but I know there have been examples in the past of people gone travelling etc by the time the final is played. It makes sense to have the league running right through, week after week, keeping the players and everyone else interested, with the final the week after the last round of games. Just start it two weeks earlier. Games are what the girls want. Then you have your break for exams, people going on holidays etc and the new championship season starts in August. Breaking the league season into two doesn't make sense.

And obviously it's insane running the minor and U16 at the same time, that's just not living in the real world, particularly if senior league is going on too!

Re the championship, they clearly have the numbers pretty dreadfully wrong if they think there's enough in intermediate!!

Clearly there are way too many grades - It should be four at the most for the amount of clubs. I'm actually staggered to read there's a Junior D. You can't just keep making up grades every time there's a new club. And then have three teams in the second highest tier? What's the thinking behind that?!
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kelf
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PostSubject: Re: Fixture Proposals and Gradings   Wed Jan 30, 2013 12:35 am

Ogie:

Be fair, the number of championship grades has been reduced (there was also a Junior E) and these are only proposals. The clubs can change them if they want to.

They do need to keep promoting and not have relegation in championships for a couple of year to increase the numbers to 8 at Senior, Inter & Junior A .

Is your club making a proposal on Thursday?
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PostSubject: Re: Fixture Proposals and Gradings   Thu Jan 31, 2013 11:24 am

The problem with having no relegation is that you can have a situation where a club is struggling at inter or senior ,you asking them to bear all the pain for a least 3 years for the benefit of everyone else, A complete revamp of championship is needed because waiting for the cream to come to the top is taking to long. At this stage there is nearly ladies football in every Gaa club, use the Gaa model, we have to get away from the idea of trying to engineer a championship win for every club which is why the thing is structured the way it is
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PostSubject: Re: Fixture Proposals and Gradings   Sat Feb 02, 2013 12:28 am

Kelf: That's your fallback every time, and while it's fair comment (and same when complaints are made about board etc) it does not mean that there is no validity to the complaints and/or comments.

You asked for reaction but you have knocked back every one.

To answer your question - Yes, my club is making a proposal. They have made many's the proposal before that got nowhere, but they'll try again.

And Ballyboy is right - restructure the thing - it's going to take too long. Are there still only three intermediate teams? No-one can suggest that the intermediate championship was satisfactory last year - and they still had to throw a club out to get it played on time!

It is good that the number of championships have been reduced Kelf but it should be no more than Senior, intermediate, junior A and B - when we get to the stage that there are a lot of second teams, then you can address that. But right now, it is utterly skewed, and that is having an impact in other many, many areas.

It is just inequitable at the moment. I don't think anyone can say otherwise. Hopefully the meeting will be positive, and while no-one is going to be happy with everything, we'll hope that there are some positive developments.

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kelf
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PostSubject: Re: Fixture Proposals and Gradings   Sat Feb 02, 2013 2:59 am


How did the meeting take the proposals re the Leagues or will they be discussed in Feb?

It is not my intention to "knock", just giving views which don't count for anything !!!

Will the proposals on Championship be up for discussion in March/April ?

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PostSubject: Re: Fixture Proposals and Gradings   Sat Feb 02, 2013 3:15 am

As the meeting was only last night, I haven't heard back yet. My fingers are crossed.

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SeeTheStars
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PostSubject: Re: Fixture Proposals and Gradings   Tue Feb 12, 2013 12:54 am

The reconvened fixtures meeting is on tomorrow evening in Naas at 7.30. This is the relevant forum for clubs to bring forward proposals on fixtures for 2013.All clubs are requested to be represented.

The proposed dates for the Minor Championship are:
Round 1 : 25th June
Round 2 : 9th July
Round 3 : 23rd July
Round 4: 24th September
Round 5: 12th October
Semi Final - 19th October
Final : 26th October
I know some clubs were concerned about trying to field teams in the Summer-now's your chance to make your feelings known in a democratic forum.
Some other proposed dates:
Under 14:
Round 1 : 11th April
Round 2 : 18th April
Round 3 : 25th April
Round 4 : 2nd May
Round 5 : 6th May
Semi Final : 11th May
Final: 1st June

Senior Championship

Round 1 : 3rd August
Round 2 : 17th August
Round 3 : 24th August
Round 4 : 31st August
Round 5 : 7th September
Semi Final : 14th September
Final : 21st September

Intermediate Club Championship
Round 1 : 17th August
Round 2 : 24th August
Round 3 : 31st August
Final : 7th September

Junior A Championship
Round 1 : 27th July
Round 2 : 3rd August
Round 3 : 10th August
Round 4 : 17th August
Round 5 : 24th August
Semi Final : 31st August
Final : 7th September


Junior B - D Championship

Round 1 : 10 August
Round 2 : 17th August
Round 3 : 24th August
Round 4 : 31st August
Round 5 : 7th September
Semi Final : 14th September
Final: 21st September



Remember it's very easy to come on to an internet forum and be negative, it's more difficult to go to a fixtures meeting and put your case across in a logical manner. A lot of the above dates are determined by Leinster and All Ireland fixtures, this applies to all grades down to under 14.


Other things to note for tomorrow evening, There is a proposal for 8 teams in each Junior grade of the championship, ie Junior D will be missing, Na Fianna have withdrawn from Championship and League and there is a couple of proposals re the draw for the championship.
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PostSubject: Re: Fixture Proposals and Gradings   Wed Feb 13, 2013 9:05 pm

Very interesting meeting last night, some great discussions an some down right pathetic, glory hunting arguments. How in the name if God did Eadestown expect to be regraded?
Good to get rid if a championship division. But why the hell wasn't the Intermediate division dealt with? Sur that's where all the problems lie.
Junior A is now a meaty division with some good games. It's just an awful shame that St. Laurence's weren't dealt with in the same manner last year when they acquired all those grange players who were living around the county.

The county board did well to get those moves through last night but should've dealt with the Intermediate division. They won't get another opportunity to correct it, last night was the time
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PostSubject: Re: Fixture Proposals and Gradings   Thu Feb 14, 2013 12:24 am

A step in the right direction at last. The championships looked very bottom heavy for a number of years good to see one of them chalked off. The Junior A will be a great championship lots of really good teams there. I wasn't at the meeting but heard there may be teams relegated from there championship while both finalists get promoted up, another good move. Lots of positives there to build on.

Whitelass i'd actually agree with you on the grading St Laurances maybe should have been graded up but not being sure of the rules around this it may not have been possible in the middle of the year. Indeed Monasterevin gained many players that were Intermediate standard and up when they started up the year before and entered into the Junior D championship. Down the line new rules will have to be brought in around transfers within a parish or it won't be too long till we see only one team within each parish surely not the way forward for ladies football.

Disappointing to see another club pulled out in Na Fianna, along with Grange and Ellistown last year. Think we played them in a challenge and they looked a very good side.

But yeah lots of positives there to build on. I'll be making sure to take in as many games as possible

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PostSubject: Re: Fixture Proposals and Gradings   Thu Feb 14, 2013 12:34 am

I wasn't aware of Monastrevin's transfer activities until last night. Sounds to me
like they've been as busy as St. Laurence's, if not busier. Who in their right mind would allow them compete at junior c or d with the players that they have? Apparently, one of their latest acquisitions has played for 4 or 5 different clubs in as many years. That is just disgraceful...

With regard to transfers. The parish rule is the bane if ladies football. It allows these clubs to poach who they like and lack their teams. Get rid of that and it should go a long way to putting a stop to clubs trying to secure over night success.

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PostSubject: Re: Fixture Proposals and Gradings   Thu Feb 14, 2013 2:59 am


Was it all transfers in or did any transfer out ?

Any changes to the grading/competitions proposals ?
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PostSubject: Re: Fixture Proposals and Gradings   Thu Feb 14, 2013 8:14 am

Whitelass wrote:
I wasn't aware of Monastrevin's transfer activities until last night. Sounds to me
like they've been as busy as St. Laurence's, if not busier. Who in their right mind would allow them compete at junior c or d with the players that they have? Apparently, one of their latest acquisitions has played for 4 or 5 different clubs in as many years. That is just disgraceful...

With regard to transfers. The parish rule is the bane if ladies football. It allows these clubs to poach who they like and lack their teams. Get rid of that and it should go a long way to putting a stop to clubs trying to secure over night success.

The parish rule is sacred to Ladies football, as most counties will have only one club per parish, KIldare are in the minority and would never get a rule change through. Dublin is the exception, the rule being that no more than seven players can transfer into a club in any year.

Intermediate needs to be fixed, but what do you suggest?
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PostSubject: Re: Fixture Proposals and Gradings   Thu Feb 14, 2013 9:26 am

Sacred to Kildare. Is that a way of saying the CB don't care? That clubs can do what they like?
Who's protecting the other clubs that Monasterevin and the likes are poaching from?

Intermediate is a joke Sea the Stars. It's the second highest level of football in this county. And there's 4 clubs in it. 2 of which rarely play.
Why, when the CB were pushing the stronger junior B clubs up, didn't they go the whole hog. Add 4 to intermediate and bring a diff 4 up to junior A?! Why was the problematic division completely ignored?
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