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 Do you back Jason Ryan to continue as Kildare manager.

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As it stands do you back Jason Ryan to continue as manager
Yes - He's building a team and needs time.
8%
 8% [ 5 ]
No - He was a wrong choice, replace now.
25%
 25% [ 15 ]
Until end of season and assess again.
52%
 52% [ 32 ]
Until end of season and replace
15%
 15% [ 9 ]
Total Votes : 61
 

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PostSubject: Do you back Jason Ryan to continue as Kildare manager.   Mon Feb 09, 2015 12:55 am

As the question suggests I merely want an indication of what the general consensus is out there amongst Kildare fans
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HauntedGraffiti
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PostSubject: Re: Do you back Jason Ryan to continue as Kildare manager.   Mon Feb 09, 2015 1:09 am

Felt he was the wrong choice at the time and I think he's on his way out after this season.

For rationale, see my post in Kildare-Meath thread.

Unfortunately, unless a specialised team is put in place whose sole remit is to get the next appointment right (Dublin, for example, do this as standard practice and look how spectacularly it's backfired), I don't particularly have any faith the next manager will be the right person either.

Grim!
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Bad News Baba
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PostSubject: Re: Do you back Jason Ryan to continue as Kildare manager.   Mon Feb 09, 2015 1:26 am

Needs to go asap.
It disappoints me that he is still the Kildare manager this morning. He should do the decent thing and admit he is out if his depth and allow a new man to have a go.

The season is a right off anyway already, the new man can run the rule over who is up for the battle and who is not.
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PostSubject: Re: Do you back Jason Ryan to continue as Kildare manager.   Mon Feb 09, 2015 1:27 am

Bad News Baba wrote:
Needs to go asap.
It disappoints me that he is still the Kildare manager this morning. He should do the decent thing and admit he is out if his depth and allow a new man to have a go.

The season is a right off anyway already, the new man can run the rule over who is up for the battle and who is not.

+1
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e.s.b.
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PostSubject: Re: Do you back Jason Ryan to continue as Kildare manager.   Mon Feb 09, 2015 1:33 am

there is a change of chairman and treasurer of the county board, so there is the chance a future appointment being handled differently. My opinion on the question asked is the current guys should get a chance to put things right and be assessed at the end of the year. They will have had 2 full years at that time and will need to have shown genuine progress to get a further term.
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PostSubject: Re: Do you back Jason Ryan to continue as Kildare manager.   Mon Feb 09, 2015 2:10 am

Not getting into past much, but as a reference point, while we lost too many quarter-finals for sure, we were a top eight team for a long spell. Was thinking where I see Kildare stand now in terms of results, performances, direction, management, underage performances and results, county board management, finances and overall hope. A lot thrown in there but as of now I'd genuinely feel we've more to be negative about, less chance to grow and aren't as good as the following:

Dublin, Kerry, Donegal, Mayo, Monaghan, Tyrone, Derry, Cork, Down, Meath, Galway, Roscommon, Cavan, Armagh, Tipperary and Clare.

So basically we've gone from a genuine top-eight, division one team to in my mind the 17th best team in the land. We aren't even tier two anymore, rather tier three with Tipp and Clare and they are places of hurling! And Clare are on the up and Tipp are winners at underage!
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PostSubject: Re: Do you back Jason Ryan to continue as Kildare manager.   Mon Feb 09, 2015 2:52 am

Don't mention the war etc, but if we're to pass Armagh while we're going in the opposite direction out of Division 2 - oh the irony!
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PostSubject: Re: Do you back Jason Ryan to continue as Kildare manager.   Mon Feb 09, 2015 2:56 am

Would only argue with two of those : Clare, who we beat last summer albeit uncomfortably and are totally unproven in Div 2 even. On the up after a good result or two no doubt but still. We also hockeyed Down in Newry last summer so I wouldn't judge our status against them simply on last Sunday's smash and grab. But in general yes we are lower Div 2 / Div 3 material at present. I actually think we have better players than that however and are lacking leadership both on and off the pitch. We can improve the off-pitch situation and I believe this week is time to let Ryan go, otherwise the season won't be salvageable. But finding on-field leaders is going to be more difficult and finding lads who don't leave their brains in the dressing room is another issue.
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PostSubject: Re: Do you back Jason Ryan to continue as Kildare manager.   Mon Feb 09, 2015 2:57 am

HauntedGraffiti wrote:
Don't mention the war etc, but if we're to pass Armagh while we're going in the opposite direction out of Division 2 - oh the irony!

Doesn't it normally take McGeeney 4 years to secure promotion though ?
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PostSubject: Re: Do you back Jason Ryan to continue as Kildare manager.   Mon Feb 09, 2015 3:01 am

Crofter wrote:
Would only argue with two of those : Clare, who we beat last summer albeit uncomfortably and are totally unproven in Div 2 even. On the up after a good result or two no doubt but still. We also hockeyed Down in Newry last summer so I wouldn't judge our status against them simply on last Sunday's smash and grab. But in general yes we are lower Div 2 / Div 3 material at present. I actually think we have better players than that however and are lacking leadership both on and off the pitch. We can improve the off-pitch situation and I believe this week is time to let Ryan go, otherwise the season won't be salvageable. But finding on-field leaders is going to be more difficult and finding lads who don't leave their brains in the dressing room is another issue.

PS just saw the mighty Clare beaten by six points by Louth - think you were knee-jerking a but quickly there Tommy. No doubt that puts Louth ahead of us alternatively.
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PostSubject: Re: Do you back Jason Ryan to continue as Kildare manager.   Mon Feb 09, 2015 4:36 am

Just feel they are going in the right direction, aren't a whole lot behind us off the field and ahead of us on it thus I said them. And think they've improved this year while we've gotten worse, so wouldn't be mad confident if we ran into them now. But either way, if we're a top 16 team, we barely are. Some drop off from being top eight with a fine manager, competitive team, underage success, fundraising capabilities via the management etc.
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PostSubject: Re: Do you back Jason Ryan to continue as Kildare manager.   Mon Feb 09, 2015 9:31 am

Rose tinted glasses there Tommy I'm afraid. If we were a genuine top 8 side for a long period as you claim then how come we only reached one provincial final and lost to Louth and Wicklow?
We avoided a lot of the top teams in the qualifiers and often met the losing provincial finalist 6 days after they lost. The one time we were coming of a final loss ourselves we had a 13 day break and met Wicklow!
We were a lot better then than we are now but McGeeney was never a tactical genius as he proved in the U21 game against Galway. Ryan will probably walk away before he is pushed but lets not forget who brought him on board in the first place.
The lack of leadership among the players is the most worrying of all. You can blame the manager as much as you like but only one team seemed to want to win that game in the 2nd half last night and only a few Kildare players seemed up for the fight.
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PostSubject: Re: Do you back Jason Ryan to continue as Kildare manager.   Mon Feb 09, 2015 9:53 am

agree with murof
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PostSubject: Re: Do you back Jason Ryan to continue as Kildare manager.   Mon Feb 09, 2015 10:36 am

We were a much better, tougher side under McGeeney and I wish he had stayed.

But some posters here overstate this. We have lost our first two games in division two. Want to know the last time that happened? In 2012, under Kieran McGeeney. We won the league that year.

They also ignore the inconvenient fact that we had a better championship last year than in 2013 (not hard mind you).

I'm not saying we're going to win the league this year. I think we're more likely to be battling at the bottom end of the table. But take the rose-tinted glasses off and assess things rationally.

To me, the biggest mistake Kieran made was the Johnston debacle. To reiterate, we not only cynically poached a player, we then brought him on to kick a free to rub Cavan's noses in it in their own back yard, when the game was already over.

I will never want to see Kildare lose but if Cavan deal out some payback to us this spring it will be hard to say we didn't have it coming. That shameful episode was Kieran McGeeney's fault and no one else's.

That is shocking, shocking judgement and it cost him his job.

Now, I wish it hadn't. I wish he was still Kildare manager. I think we would be a better side under him and while I still can't wrap my head around the Johnston thing, I admire Kieran's honesty, courage and complete commitment to Kildare. And I am thankful for the great days we enjoyed under him from 2008-2011.

But this idea that everything was going great for Kieran towards the end of his tenure and Ryan has come in and butchered it all is simplistic at best and at worst, simply a lie.

This is a rot that began in 2012 and the simple fact is that the players we have had at our disposal since then are not as good as the ones we had from 09-11.
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PostSubject: Re: Do you back Jason Ryan to continue as Kildare manager.   Mon Feb 09, 2015 10:54 am

Just to illustrate the players thing: In the first few years of his reign, Kieran had Dermot Earley or Darryl Flynn and sometimes both to play midfield. He had one of the best forwards in the country, John Doyle. He had a host of good inter-county players like Morgan O'Flaherty, Hugh McGrillen, Mick Foley, Leper, James Kavanagh, Alan Smith and Emmet Bolton.

Even those who remain are past their best, with the possible exception of Bolton.

Of the new players, Eoin Doyle is the only one who consistently looks capable of playing to the level of any of the above.

You can play any formation you like, but without outstanding players, results are going to be worse.

Everyone repeats this mantra about what good players we have. I don't see it. Which of our players would get a championship start with Dublin, Kerry, Cork, Mayo or Donegal?

I think only Doyle on current form. Bolton, if he remains at his best, might sneak on to one or two of those teams.

If you think different, then name them, and tell me who you'd drop from any of those teams.
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PostSubject: Re: Do you back Jason Ryan to continue as Kildare manager.   Mon Feb 09, 2015 8:10 pm

Think you need to title this "Managing Fans Expectations". Its clear we do have:
1. Some excellent backs in Kelly, Fitzpatrick, Doyle & O'Grady
2. A kick out strategy that seems to work

We don't have:
1. Half forwards that don't want to work for the team i.e. Leper & Flats
2. Daraoch Mulhall who is excellent going forward but don't ask him to track back
3. Midfielders, P. O'Neill & Chalky are good players but playing out of position on the county team.
4. An idea what goes on with the full forward's

But clearly what are peoples expectations, imho
1. We're not a Div. 1 side, we are a Div 2 side and will remain there.
2. We're not going to win Leinster in the next 3 years if we keep coming up against Dublin no matter who the manager is
3. Until CB, clubs, Club Kildare & manager are united you can forget about it because their is no ambition there.
4. Where do we find the forwards????
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PostSubject: Re: Do you back Jason Ryan to continue as Kildare manager.   Mon Feb 09, 2015 8:33 pm

Why aren't we a Division One side. It's hard to talk about the present without mentioning the recent past. Someone said we were not a top eight side across a long spell from 2008-2012, show me eight better. And why were we Division One last year, Division One semi-finalists two years ago, with a superb under-21 team that kicked away an All Ireland with wide after wide, and now suddenly we are Division Two with no hope of promotion and a great chance of relegation. What exactly went wrong here? Often thought a big part of what McGeeney did was bring about belief and for a while Kildare people stopped looking at their shoes when the big kids called around. Seems that's gone too.

Not saying we'll get near a Leinster title in next 20 years, but being a top eight side shouldn't exactly be out of the question. Two of Roscommon, Down, Galway and Cavan will likely be Division One next year, can we not aspire to such dizzying heights and expect that much?
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PostSubject: Re: Do you back Jason Ryan to continue as Kildare manager.   Mon Feb 09, 2015 8:50 pm

Stonecold wrote:
Think you need to title this "Managing Fans Expectations". Its clear we do have:
1. Some excellent backs in Kelly, Fitzpatrick, Doyle & O'Grady
2. A kick out strategy that seems to work

We don't have:
1. Half forwards that don't want to work for the team i.e. Leper & Flats
Managers job to either make them or drop them for some one who will

2. Daraoch Mulhall who is excellent going forward but don't ask him to track back
Managers job to make him or drop him for someone who will

3. Midfielders, P. O'Neill & Chalky are good players but playing out of position on the county team.
Managers job to recognise the players best positions and play them there, or find a system that negates deficiencies in an area

4. An idea what goes on with the full forward's
Managers job to get the forwards playing to a system not off the cuff, where the other players have no idea what is going to happen next

But clearly what are peoples expectations, imho
1. We're not a Div. 1 side, we are a Div 2 side and will remain there.
Irrelevant until the manager does his job properly

2. We're not going to win Leinster in the next 3 years if we keep coming up against Dublin no matter who the manager is
Irrelevant until the manger does his job properly

3. Until CB, clubs, Club Kildare & manager are united you can forget about it because their is no ambition there.
Club Kildare was doing a good job until the CB and Croke Park stuck their noses in, now it's a disaster

4. Where do we find the forwards????
Managers job to get a system in place to best use what we have
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PostSubject: Re: Do you back Jason Ryan to continue as Kildare manager.   Mon Feb 09, 2015 9:12 pm

17 people voted a certain way but the vocals ruling the roost again. Think its easy to blame the manager, Kildare had 13 men behind the ball most of Saturday night dunno what other way you can negate things than drop a load of blocks and build a wall. Dunno why players 1 to 9 seem to put themselves on the line for the manager whilst players from 10 to 15 are only half arsed but I guess that's the managers fault. I suppose its the manager fault that we were 100% accurate in the 1st half, never seen that statistic for Kildare before! Guess its his fault that we blew the lead going in the final stretch of the last 2 games.


And btw Club Kildare was & has been poor before CB & Croke park.
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PostSubject: Re: Do you back Jason Ryan to continue as Kildare manager.   Mon Feb 09, 2015 9:46 pm

"Vocal's" what are you bleating about. I's my opinion he is not doing a good enough job. You it seems are happy enough with him. You'll find you're in a club of about 1 in that.

Who's idea is it to have 13 men behind the ball and one Full forward who I'd fancy out sprinting. Do you think the players got in their huddle before the game and decided this is what we are going to do. You are as naive as they come if you think that.

It is the managers fault if the players are not putting in the effort. He is there to motivate them, make them do what he wants. If they are not, then get them off and let someone who will have a go.

Just for you, it was club Kildare who kept the CB from going under for years. It was Club Kildare who found our sponsor, while the CB where putting adverts in the leader begging some one to sponsor us. They might not have been perfect but they are in another league from what we have now.
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PostSubject: Re: Do you back Jason Ryan to continue as Kildare manager.   Mon Feb 09, 2015 9:53 pm

Ohtoohtobe wrote:
Just to illustrate the players thing: In the first few years of his reign, Kieran had Dermot Earley or Darryl Flynn and sometimes both to play midfield. He had one of the best forwards in the country, John Doyle. He had a host of good inter-county players like Morgan O'Flaherty, Hugh McGrillen, Mick Foley, Leper, James Kavanagh, Alan Smith and Emmet Bolton.

Even those who remain are past their best, with the possible exception of Bolton.

Of the new players, Eoin Doyle is the only one who consistently looks capable of playing to the level of any of the above.

You can play any formation you like, but without outstanding players, results are going to be worse.

Everyone repeats this mantra about what good players we have. I don't see it. Which of our players would get a championship start with Dublin, Kerry, Cork, Mayo or Donegal?

I think only Doyle on current form. Bolton, if he remains at his best, might sneak on to one or two of those teams.

If you think different, then name them, and tell me who you'd drop from any of those teams.

We had no outstanding players when McGeeney came aboard. I remember Stuart McKenzie Smyth playing for him in his first league game which we drew away to Tyrone, who had won the All Ireland in 2007



McGeeney made the players I have highlighted in bold the players they were. Hugh McGrillen couldn't get his game on the u21 side. McGeeney plucked him from obscurity. Kavanagh was a best mediocre even though it was evident he had talent. Foley won an All Star under the guidance of McGeeney. I remember Emmet Bolton being just an average club player playing intercounty, I know this because I played against him.
I remeber Leper player corner back under Crofton. I remember Peter Kelly playing with the Kildare Juniors and not standing out.
It's convenient to say that Ryan didn't have these please. Arguably Ryan still has some of these players and better coming through with the likes of Eoghan Doyle, O'Grady, Hyland ect and is making a dogs mickey of it.

It's far too easy to say Ryan hasn't got the players. It is his job to make O'Grady the next Peter Kelly. His job to make Mulhall the next Tadhg Fennin, Moolick the next Earley, Eoghan Doyle the next Glen Ryan.
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PostSubject: Re: Do you back Jason Ryan to continue as Kildare manager.   Mon Feb 09, 2015 9:57 pm

Stonecold wrote:
17 people voted a certain way but the vocals ruling the roost again. Think its easy to blame the manager, Kildare had 13 men behind the ball most of Saturday night dunno what other way you can negate things than drop a load of blocks and build a wall. Dunno why players 1 to 9 seem to put themselves on the line for the manager whilst players from 10 to 15 are only half arsed but I guess that's the managers fault. I suppose its the manager fault that we were 100% accurate in the 1st half, never seen that statistic for Kildare before! Guess its his fault that we blew the lead going in the final stretch of the last 2 games.


And btw Club Kildare was & has been poor before CB & Croke park.

We created 7 scoring chances in 35 minutes of football. It's just as well we were 100% accurate . I can't remember the last time we created so little in one half of football. It's also quite clear you have no understanding of football or indeed played it when you slate 10-15 for being half arsed.
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PostSubject: Re: Do you back Jason Ryan to continue as Kildare manager.   Mon Feb 09, 2015 10:10 pm

Rex wrote:
"Vocal's" what are you bleating about. I's my opinion he is not doing a good enough job. You it seems are happy enough with him. You'll find you're in a club of about 1 in that.

Who's idea is it to have 13 men behind the ball and one Full forward who I'd fancy out sprinting. Do you think the players got in their huddle before the game and decided this is what we are going to do. You are as naive as they come if you think that.

It is the managers fault if the players are not putting in the effort. He is there to motivate them, make them do what he wants. If they are not, then get them off and let someone who will have a go.

Just for you, it was club Kildare who kept the CB from going under for years. It was Club Kildare who found our sponsor, while the CB where putting adverts in the leader begging some one to sponsor us. They might not have been perfect but they are in another league from what we have now.

Where did I say I was happy with him??? You lay it all at his door when clearly it's not, that's naivety for ya. We're not being outclassed but loosing focus and not closing out games.

We bitch, begrudge and moan about Dublin and their set-up but do feck all about it. Their CB, clubs, supporters clubs are united on one front and we all laughed at their little blue book.

And I thought it was McGeeney who nailed our sponsor, but compared to other county supporter's set-up's Club Kildare is pretty shite and has been for years.

McGeeney is gone 2 years now and people still stuck there, Ryan will be gone at the end of this year and then what's the plan... It's like that club thread that descended into the Moorefield v Sarsfields drivel........
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PostSubject: Re: Do you back Jason Ryan to continue as Kildare manager.   Tue Feb 10, 2015 12:12 am

FK. Against my better judgement, one last time.
You don't even know who won the All-Ireland in 2007.
You don't even know what Stuart McKenzie-Smith looks like.


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PostSubject: Re: Do you back Jason Ryan to continue as Kildare manager.   Tue Feb 10, 2015 12:24 am

I know Stuart better than you think Ohto. I was at the All Ireland Final in 07 and 08, I got the years mixed up.

Were at the game yourself on Saturday night by the way?
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