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 championship club draw

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Ohtoohtobe
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PostSubject: Re: championship club draw   Wed Aug 26, 2015 1:38 pm

Just on the Eoin Doyle and the defensive football things.

A player shows a bit of a mean streak and we read he needs to cut it out of his game.

Teams defend in numbers and they're being horribly defensive.

Then the county side gets hammered by Dublin or Kerry and we hear we're too nice and not defensive enough.

You can't have it every way.

Now I do think club sides should play positive football and it's sad to hear of a talented side like Athy playing that way.

But on the Doyle thing, I completely disagree. I was glad to hear he was sent off. Kildare footballers are far too nice to the point of being soft and rather than getting Doyle to take the edge off his game we should be looking for more players like him.

The same applied to Mac Lochlainn and Daryl Flynn a few years ago. Kept reading criticism of them here but the truth is we needed more players with that aggressive, borderline nasty streak. Look at Tyrone and Kerry. They are ruthless.
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Westside
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PostSubject: Re: championship club draw   Wed Aug 26, 2015 7:34 pm

Ohtoohtobe wrote:
Just on the Eoin Doyle and the defensive football things.

A player shows a bit of a mean streak and we read he needs to cut it out of his game.

Teams defend in numbers and they're being horribly defensive.

Then the county side gets hammered by Dublin or Kerry and we hear we're too nice and not defensive enough.

You can't have it every way.

Now I do think club sides should play positive football and it's sad to hear of a talented side like Athy playing that way.

But on the Doyle thing, I completely disagree. I was glad to hear he was sent off. Kildare footballers are far too nice to the point of being soft and rather than getting Doyle to take the edge off his game we should be looking for more players like him.

The same applied to Mac Lochlainn and Daryl Flynn a few years ago. Kept reading criticism of them here but the truth is we needed more players with that aggressive, borderline nasty streak. Look at Tyrone and Kerry. They are ruthless.

The only problem with this is that MacLoughlin couldnt actually play a whole lot so had to rely on pulling a dragging. Whats the point of being dirty if it isnt effective.

Look at the Mayo backs, I wouldnt say there's a nasty streak in Higgins, Cafferkey,Boyle, Cunniffe, Keegan etc. There just good players who play the game right. This bulls*t about being tough and match shouldnt even come into it when talking about the Kildare team.
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Botch
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PostSubject: Re: championship club draw   Wed Aug 26, 2015 7:52 pm

spot on westie.
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jj
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PostSubject: Re: championship club draw   Wed Aug 26, 2015 9:05 pm

steviegenius wrote:
I hate this type of football with a passion as botch said all the teams are doing the same tactics with men behind the ball its a phase we are going through at the moment and until someone has the balls to change this is the way we are going unfortunately.

What I don't agree with is what JJ said that club football is very poor at the moment. Can you say that you have seen club football in other counties to compare. My club has played teams from Dublin Meath Offaly Louth Galway Westmeath to name a few and more often than not we have beating them. I think its very lazy and easy to say things like that. Its like listening to the boys on the Sunday Game with the football they are more or less always talking about the negative stuff how poor that was etc, but you would'nt hear that from the Hurling boys..

I'm presuming it's challenge games you are talking about ? Are they really a good indicator. Nobody can convince me that the standard of club football is good in the county at the moment I'm afraid. No Kildare club has reached a Leinster Senior club final since 2006, in which time Westmeath, Laois and Offaly have been represented.
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PostSubject: Re: championship club draw   Thu Aug 27, 2015 6:08 am

Ohtoohtobe wrote:


But on the Doyle thing, I completely disagree. I was glad to hear he was sent off. Kildare footballers are far too nice to the point of being soft and rather than getting Doyle to take the edge off his game we should be looking for more players like him.

The same applied to Mac Lochlainn and Daryl Flynn a few years ago. Kept reading criticism of them here but the truth is we needed more players with that aggressive, borderline nasty streak. Look at Tyrone and Kerry. They are ruthless.

Glad to hear a player was sent off!?! Sweet Jesus......
The easiest thing to do is get sent off in a match. Eoin got sent off for nothing but he should never have put himself in that situation. What he did was not aggressive or ruthless, it was just stupid, and he can keep the aggressive edge to his play and still avoid situations like that. A player can only help his team by being on the pitch. Getting sent off just puts the responsibility on the other 14.
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Ohtoohtobe
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PostSubject: Re: championship club draw   Thu Aug 27, 2015 2:21 pm

Nah I still disagree. Obviously getting sent off is counter-productive but if you play near the edge it will happen the odd time.

Do ye boys listen to what the rest of the country says about Kildare? McGeeney told the players when he took over that the perception out there was Kildare = soft.
Colm O'Rourke said before the Kerry game this year that they were lads you wouldn't mind your daughter going out with but that niceness meant they would never win big games.

That's why when I see Eoin Doyle not giving ground, getting in opposition faces, I wish we'd 14 more like him. Instead we have too many lads who won't even resort to aggression when the opposition is walking in goal number seven.

But then they come back to club and the first box thrown is greeted with uproar. Try watching a championship game in North Kerry or Tyrone. Read what Paul Galvin, for example, says about the club environment he grew up in. It might not be pretty but it breeds better footballers with a harder mindset who are ruthless.

When you go to play these teams, yes you need to be skillful, but first you need to establish your right to play, to show you're not going to take a backward step. That's why Tyrone are able to give Kerry a game and we're not. They're not afraid of them and we're petrified.

We saw that in the second half of the All-Ireland quarter-final. As well as being much more skillful than us Kerry were able and were let push us around and humiliate us.
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Botch
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PostSubject: Re: championship club draw   Thu Aug 27, 2015 9:08 pm

I think there is a difference in playing hard and honest and playing over the edge. Players get a rep from playing hard ball without playing the game.
I think what is being said is that when some county players come back to play club they play the hard man without actually concentrating on the game and just playing well.
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PostSubject: Re: championship club draw   Thu Aug 27, 2015 10:07 pm

Have to agree it's a fine line and needs a certain amount of cunning and calculation. Take the Kerry v Mayo replay last year, Kerry saw that there was an incompetent muppet in charge with a history of "letting the game flow", so a the tactics deployed around the middle third of the pitch bordered on assault. (The not sending off of Shane Enright and some other dubious decisions were not the losing of the game for Mayo). Eoin Doyle and others need to develop a knowledge of the opposition, referees and what the current media focus is and then deploy the correct level of "presence" onto the opposing team.
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murof
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PostSubject: Re: championship club draw   Thu Aug 27, 2015 10:47 pm

The great Kerry team of the late 70's had some brilliantly talented and athletic players but they also had 3 enforcers at the back in Paidi, Kenelly and Denihan. Down in Cork many still claim that JBM gave up football and concentrated on hurling after the amount of cynical fouling particularly by Denihan.
Successful teams tend to get away with it, Tyrone and Meath spring to mind. Would love to see more Kildare players like Glen Ryan. He was hard but he could play with the best. Kildare defenders are far to nice for their own good and opposing players know it pays to run at them.
Moorefield are the only senior club who play with that edge but while successful in Kildare it hasn't done much for them in Leinster since 06.
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Botch
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PostSubject: Re: championship club draw   Thu Aug 27, 2015 11:03 pm

Good footballers can do it all. Play it tough or play it open. Kerry can do both because they are good footballers. Kildare a nice footballers so when it gets tough they are found wanting. We are miles away from Kerry and Dublin and Mayo and others. What we can do is work hard on what we have and try to improve.
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Botch
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PostSubject: Re: championship club draw   Thu Aug 27, 2015 11:19 pm

Good footballers can do it all. Play it tough or play it open. Kerry can do both because they are good footballers. Kildare a nice footballers so when it gets tough they are found wanting. We are miles away from Kerry and Dublin and Mayo and others. What we can do is work hard on what we have and try to improve.
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shortgrass1928
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PostSubject: Re: championship club draw   Fri Aug 28, 2015 1:05 am

One of toughest and most ruthless teams in recent times had been the Kilkenny hurlers. The never take a backward step and have no fear of fighting fire with fire. But how often have you seen a KK player sent off for an off the ball incident like Doyler got into? If clobbering lads off the ball and having reputations as hard men won matches then the Wicklow footballers would have won plenty of All Ireland's.

Hard and tough does not mean dirty & Doyler does not need to get a name for himself as the latter. He is too good of a footballer for that. We need more players like him who are not prepared to be pushed around by anyone but that is world away from what happened against Carbury.
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Caprea
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PostSubject: Re: championship club draw   Fri Aug 28, 2015 2:26 am

God, I must be blind, i thought he didn't do anything really and I was looking straight at it.
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kelf
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PostSubject: Re: championship club draw   Fri Aug 28, 2015 3:34 am

Players need to be cute.....  I will give a couple of examples from last Sunday

A Maher has ball in the middle. Ty player, from behind, whacks his elbow with flat arm ( striking  but ref let both sides away with it) ball loose Ty in & Barry falls over, peno !!!!  No mention of clatter on Maher.  This flat arm strike to elbow or ribs seems to be coached. On Sky Jim McG complimented it a few times as "tackle" which it certainly is not....

Ty on attack, ball breaks, Ky defender goes to pick it up, big Paudie graps his jersey & haluls him away from ball & dumps him, Tiernan of the hair pulls on loose ball, wide with keeper covering. Media all guff about great chance missed, no mention of blantant foull from Big McNulty.

3 long balls into Donaghy. Each time Justin kept one arm high & flailing supposedly for the ball while the other arm or back/shoulder held & body then shunted "Star".  No frees ,,,,,  again a tactic to learn...  

If refs are going to allow 3rd man "clearing road" & flat arm wallops ( one Ty lad walked for one on Cooper which was just too good !!!) Kildare need to brush up on the tactics ....


Last edited by kelf on Fri Aug 28, 2015 3:35 am; edited 1 time in total
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rob11
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PostSubject: Re: championship club draw   Sun Aug 30, 2015 8:59 am

Larries 0-14 Athy 1-8

Not many would have picked Jtb, Naas, Celbridge and Larries to be the four quarter finalists at the start of the year. Championship looks very open this year.
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Carburyhill
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PostSubject: Re: championship club draw   Sun Aug 30, 2015 9:12 am

I would say that any team that comes through round 3 would fancy there chances against any of the 4 teams in the quarters. Wide open this year.
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Botch
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PostSubject: Re: championship club draw   Sun Aug 30, 2015 9:13 pm

Yeah its wide open. Still think Moorefield will be there or ther abouts.
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lilysavage
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PostSubject: Re: championship club draw   Sun Aug 30, 2015 11:05 pm

Celbridge and Moorefield a bit ahead of the rest.
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Gaa1928
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PostSubject: Re: championship club draw   Mon Aug 31, 2015 9:00 pm

Moorefield v Sarsfields throw in this Saturday changed from 5.45 p.m. to 1.45 p.m.
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steviegenius
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PostSubject: Re: championship club draw   Mon Aug 31, 2015 10:05 pm

Carbury v Leixlip is now on at 3.30 after the Moores v Sash Game.
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TommyKeegan
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PostSubject: Re: championship club draw   Tue Sep 01, 2015 1:28 am

Gaa1928 wrote:
Moorefield v Sarsfields throw in this Saturday changed from 5.45 p.m. to 1.45 p.m.

Sounds like the Glasgow derby! Less drinking time, less violence Very Happy
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murof
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PostSubject: Re: championship club draw   Tue Sep 01, 2015 2:03 am

TommyKeegan wrote:
Gaa1928 wrote:
Moorefield v Sarsfields throw in this Saturday changed from 5.45 p.m. to 1.45 p.m.

Sounds like the Glasgow derby! Less drinking time, less violence Very Happy

The quality of football in Newbridge will probably be a lot higher than the Glasgow derby!
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Gaa1928
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PostSubject: Re: championship club draw   Tue Sep 01, 2015 9:31 pm

Will the draw for the Q/Finals be an open draw or will the unbeaten teams to date be kept separate,
i.e. JTB, St.Laurences, Naas and Celbridge in the senior.
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umpireonditch
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PostSubject: Re: championship club draw   Tue Sep 01, 2015 10:23 pm

Open draw, just no repeat fixtures I believe!
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PostSubject: Re: championship club draw   Wed Sep 02, 2015 3:27 am

I really enjoy the current format in place, seems to be a good balance of meaningful games all the way through.

However the one gripe is the lack of seeding for the quarters. You would think that by winning 2 from 2 you should be seeded. The likelihood is (and I know there are exceptions!) that if a team has only won 1 game they will be weaker than the 2 from 2s.
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