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 Kildare v Cork

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Rex
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v Cork   Mon Jul 27, 2015 7:42 pm

A slight bit of praise there from Eugene, nothing over the top though, it was all through gritted teeth.

His first line is classic McGee. Passive aggressive, insulting you with a smile, follwed up by "Those three were ringleaders in a team of leaders such as you rarely see in white-jerseyed players". the man just can't help himself. Bad year for him though as we took out both Offaly and Longford.
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v Cork   Mon Jul 27, 2015 8:17 pm

Ohtoohtobe wrote:
Crofter wrote:
Just curious but how do you define or assess "our level"? If you take your earlier arguments we must ignore the league as merely a pre-season warm up. If you take championship and look at "our level" from the point Ryan took over, we'd been in Quarter Finals 5 years out of 6. So our level was presumably top 8 with a bunch of talented under 21's coming through. Certainly our level was therefore above the Roscommons, Cavans, Downs and possibly Armaghs who had nothing like that record. Just curious..

First on the league, it is far more important than a warm-up. I'm just saying championship overrides it and is what a team is judged on. Would you trade this season for Roscommon's, who were promoted to division one and lost to Fermanagh and Sligo in championship? I don't think you would. I think if Kildare lost to two teams like that in championship, you'd be on here having a meltdown even if we'd won the last three leagues. And I think you'd have a point.

As for our level. Fair question. My opinion:

I'd put Kerry, Mayo, Donegal and Dublin as the elite.

I'd put Tyrone, Monaghan and Cork below them (all three have rattled/beaten one of the top four this year).

I'd say the next dozen or so teams are all capable of beating each other on a given day. I would rank us in the middle of this. Teams in this bracket (in no particular order): Galway, Roscommon, Tipperary, Kildare, Meath, Laois, Westmeath, Armagh, Cavan, Derry, Down. Probably Fermanagh too, after this year. 

Teams below that are either shyte or lack consistency but can be dangerous (Sligo beating Roscommon, Longford beating Derry, etc).



Unfair to compare the team that made five quarters running with this one because they're completely different teams. Only surviving personnel from 2011 to 2015 are probably past their absolute peak while still being very useful (eg Leper, Paudie, Emmet, etc). But by my reckoning 10 of the starting 15 on Saturday had nothing to do with the team you're referring to or were just getting their first start as that era ended.

We didn't make the quarters in 2013 and 2014 as that team broke up and a new one was built. Great to be back there, I thought it might take another year or two (regardless of the manager). As Ciaran Whelan said while talking about Cribbin and Niallers on TSG, it takes time to adapt to this level out of underage.

Glad we agree you have to take some cognisance of league performance and of course we both agree championship is more important. But playing in Div 3 next year will not help us maintain a high level of performance - just my opinion. Would I prefer Roscommon's season - of course not - but I would never regard them as a benchmark for us anyway. They have a tiny playing population and don't have the same potential as Kildare over the longer term.

You have an interesting perspective on the level we were at when Ryan took over (which was my question really rather than where we are now). The previous manager who must not be named was removed because he was not able to keep us at the Quarter Final level while transitioning through a bunch of raw under-21's. So surely that must have been the bench mark level Jason was expected to maintain us at. Certainly above most of the bunch of also-rans (Laois, Cavan ?) you now place us on a par with.

Look, at the end of the day, we had a great win on Saturday and for now everything is rightly positive looked at through the narrow gaze of championship results (let's ignore the standard of preparation we'll have next year and the apparent alienation of some players). We can debate Cork's issues but at the end of the day our lads did their job from first minute to last. Back-boned by three or four outstanding former under-21's we seem to be moving in the right direction. That's two very good performances in a row - I thought the Offaly one was very patchy against a Div 4 team but it was a week after the Dublin debacle. Longford was very good but again they were Div 4 this year. If we run Kerry close on Sunday I think the job has to Ryan's for another year and this year will ultimately have laid the foundations for a better future. But let's get the hell out of Div 3 at the first attempt as it's no place to be preparing for championship in my opinion.
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murof
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v Cork   Mon Jul 27, 2015 9:23 pm

Wouldn't worry to much about Div 3 tbh. It will give us a chance to try out some more of the minors from the last few years and maybe give a rest to some of the older players to rest and recover from injury. No reason we cant bounce straight back up with the quality of players we have at our disposal.
Easy to say Cork were poor but the pace and movement of Kildare throughout the game meant they never got a chance to settle. It would be nice if Brolly could have acknowledged that rather than dismissing us totally. But we have bigger things to worry about now thankfully.
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lilysavage
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v Cork   Mon Jul 27, 2015 11:11 pm

Dint worry about what Brolley thinks, what Kerry people think or anyine else.
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SeamusMurphy
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v Cork   Tue Jul 28, 2015 1:58 am

flourman wrote:
SeamusMurphy wrote:

Kildare by 2. Wink

Now we're at it ...

Ah Me ould Flour, Im a wee bit hung over thanks to Paddy Powers Beer Tokens drunken
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SeamusMurphy
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v Cork   Tue Jul 28, 2015 2:42 am

While little Marty didnt do too bad.. He missed what was a definite Peno when Podge was tripped inside the square.. and how did He allow Colm O Neills Goal from the free stand ? .. He was nearly on the 6 Yard line when striking it.
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v Cork   Tue Jul 28, 2015 2:50 am

He also had his back turned to it watching the substitution and never blew his whistle but other than that it was perfectly legitimate. He had a good game in fairness, I believe we have never lost a championship game he has reffed!
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v Cork   Tue Jul 28, 2015 3:01 am

Dinny Breen wrote:
He also had his back turned to it watching the substitution and never blew his whistle but other than that it was perfectly legitimate. He had a good game in fairness, I believe we have never lost a championship game he has reffed!

How was it legitimate ?. as it was taken well inside where the foul took place.
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murof
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v Cork   Tue Jul 28, 2015 3:11 am

Even so it should never gone into the net. Kildare players looked far to casual on the line, thinking the game was effectively over. Expect something similar if Cooper gets a free like he did against Cork.
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Dinny Breen
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v Cork   Tue Jul 28, 2015 3:33 am

SeamusMurphy wrote:
Dinny Breen wrote:
He also had his back turned to it watching the substitution and never blew his whistle but other than that it was perfectly legitimate. He had a good game in fairness, I believe we have never lost a championship game he has reffed!

How was it legitimate ?. as it was taken well inside where the foul took place.

Sarcasm Seamus sarcasm!
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v Cork   Tue Jul 28, 2015 4:18 am

Anybody know how we can get a bainisteoir top for joe brolly to help Kerry in the dug out on Sunday.how to beat Kildare. he was given the national air waves to tell this is how to beat Kildare hit the shite out. Them . Well joe we kicked the shite out of your country a few year ago in the championship in Derry . What a arsehole no one small bit of credit did he give us last night ? He hates Kildare for as long I seen him on tv . On about Monaghan what they would do to Kildare we had there measures last year the needed a late point to get extra time . If we won a Sam he say it was a fluke
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v Cork   Tue Jul 28, 2015 4:49 am

I loved Brolly last night - talked incessantly about Cork; about the Man Utd youth team manager; about Monaghan; about "knocking shite" out of Kildare; about everything and anything - no credit at all where credit was due. And Fermanagh - with the same space against Westmeath - "tore into the opposition and kicked magnificent points." Consistency is right - not just the referees who don't have it  Shocked . Ironic that Ciaran Whelan and Des (two Dubs) were left to bring in some balance. Long may it be so!


Last edited by tomoneillandhissisteranne on Tue Jul 28, 2015 5:08 am; edited 2 times in total
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v Cork   Tue Jul 28, 2015 5:02 am

Johnny Doyle on off the ball newstalk to night
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v Cork   Tue Jul 28, 2015 5:24 am

white boy wrote:
Johnny Doyle on off the ball newstalk to night

Emmet Bolton (as well?) I heard them say 7.45pm
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v Cork   Tue Jul 28, 2015 5:57 am

Only 2 of our 225 hand passes went astray against Cork. Shocked


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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v Cork   Tue Jul 28, 2015 6:16 am

Hope Lepper will be OK for Kerry game.

I thought Eoin Cadogan took him out ( Lepper was in the air & Cadogan went under him) and shoulda been a peno as should Shields trip on Podge. Cork lucky not to have been a lot further behind,
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v Cork   Tue Jul 28, 2015 2:49 pm

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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v Cork   Tue Jul 28, 2015 6:42 pm

Great post Taibi

Very interesting to see Eoin Doyle with three assists from centre back and Lyons with 1 point and two assists from corner back, is there another corner back in the country who can defend and attack like him
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v Cork   Tue Jul 28, 2015 7:04 pm

An absolute whinge fest in the Irish Times on behalf of Cork from Jim McGuinness. Gives Kildare absolutely no credit while doing his best self promotion, "This would never have happened in the championship structure I suggested, amn't I so clever?". Even though his new championship structure is practically the same as the one every fucker has proposed.

http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/jim-mcguinness-cork-victims-of-flawed-all-ireland-championship-format-1.2298938

Jim McGuinness wrote:

Kildare lay in tatters after being obliterated in a Leinster semi-final but they had time to think about it and to re-evaluate and to bring people back together and then prepare to push again. Theirs was a gradual and deliberate restoration of confidence. They brought all the psychological momentum into Saturday night last whereas Cork were in reverse thrust.

We had less time to think about it before we faced Offaly (in Offaly) after that demoralising annihilation by Dublin in Croke Park than Cork did after the replayed Munster final (which was in the rain don't you know? In Kerry!! Who'd a thunk it?).
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v Cork   Tue Jul 28, 2015 7:32 pm

It really doesn't bother me what the media experts say about Kildare - it all just adds to the seize mentality that Bolton alluded to in his interview last night.
The team are obviously pissed with what's been leveled at them from both inside and outside the county - and if they can continue to channel that energy positively, the media can write whatever they like.
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v Cork   Tue Jul 28, 2015 7:37 pm

An issue Kildare have had for a few years now is that we don't have enough top quality players. Since Earley and JD retired we don't have many stars anymore but alot of good players and some young lads with big potential.

The Cork game felt like a turning point for Kildare. For the first time in ages there was a spine to the team with young players really taking responsibility.
O'Grady, Doyle, Moolick, Cribben, Kelly all really stood up and showed they could become top players.
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v Cork   Tue Jul 28, 2015 7:40 pm

Got there before me. I was just about to post about that article myself. I know you don't win for the acclaim of others but a recognition of how well Kildare played would not go a miss. The whole narrative since Saturday has been how poor Cork were due to their six day gap even though it was seven.

Kildare had a real six day gap between Dublin and we played in Offaly's back yard. I think considering the whinging of every pundit about Cork's lack of time to recover that the win against Offaly is way more impressive than it was ever conveyed by the real "keyboard warriors" in the media.

I believe if we had lost to Offaly not one pundit, or journalist would have mentioned the time gap. It's mentioned now because it suits their aforementioned narrative.
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v Cork   Tue Jul 28, 2015 9:53 pm

At the end of the day Cork or Kerry knew that if they lost the Munster final replay that they would be playing the following week against Kildare that is the nature of the championship as it was for Kildare against Offaly. We keep hearing that teams train like professionals well professional teams have to go out week in week out suffer set backs but you can be sure a professional team would be ready the next day for the next challenge so a far as i'm concerned Cork were just feeling sorry for them self's and fair play to Kildare they took advantage and a huge win.
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v Cork   Tue Jul 28, 2015 10:12 pm

The way some of the Cork supporters were going on in the week before the game, Kildare were just a minor distraction, and Cork were already preparing for the quarter final.

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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v Cork   Tue Jul 28, 2015 10:26 pm

stanley wrote:
The way some of the Cork supporters were going on in the week before the game, Kildare were just a minor distraction, and Cork were already preparing for the quarter final.


I hope we prove to be more than just a minor distraction for Kerry and we can bring more of the young lads from the past few successful minor teams through and start to build a quality squad again over the next few years.
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