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 Kildare v westmeath

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SeamusMurphy
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v westmeath   Wed Jun 29, 2016 11:29 am

Watched the live recording this evening, couldn't stomach it till now. . I didn't realise WM hadn't beat us in championship for 60 year's.
Tom carrs quote " that we looked like a bunch of fellas that we're picked up on the way, and don't really want to be out there ", while harsh, hard to argue.
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Botch
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v westmeath   Wed Jun 29, 2016 10:28 pm

Lets face it. We have a bunch of average footballers at county level. They are being programmed to play systems that they cannot or not good enough to play. We should go toe to toe with teams like westmeath and offaly and make switches appropriately. ie help out on the danger players. At times against westmeath we had 2 or 3 lads just standing in space defending. We should of pushed right up and tackled.
On the other hand our tackling is a disgrace. Its been like this all year. One does not need to kill a lad when he is coming through. Hold him up, get up to speed beside him. TACKLE THE BALL.
I worry for the standard of football in the county. The club scene is dieing a death at the moment. Would it not improve the club scene to let the county lads play more often and thus we might uncover new talent. Guys who have the MATCH SKILLS to tackle, kick pass nad take score. They can do this because they are doing it every weekend.
To look at the county team sometimes you would feel they never handled trained with the ball. Sloppy kicking, catching, score taking.. list can go on.
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sarsno1
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v westmeath   Thu Jun 30, 2016 1:16 am

Totally agree Botch 100%
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SeamusMurphy
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v westmeath   Thu Jun 30, 2016 1:19 am

Crofter wrote:
Team the next day:

Rex

Jimmers
TommyO'Neill
Taibi

Kildare Blade
Kelf
OhTooBe

Murof
Stonecold

Xavi
Inexile
Celbridgelad

TommyONeill's Sister
Tommy Keegan
Ogie

(a few blow ins in true Micko/McGeeney tradition)

Can we do any worse?

That's shite crofter, I'm walking away. I'm not doing waterboy again.
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Taibi
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v westmeath   Thu Jun 30, 2016 9:34 am

Botch wrote:
Lets face it.  We have a bunch of average footballers at county level.  They are being programmed to play systems that they cannot or not good enough to play.  We should go toe to toe with teams like westmeath and offaly and make switches appropriately.  ie help out on the danger players.  At times against westmeath we had 2 or 3 lads just standing in space defending.  We should of pushed right up and tackled.
On the other hand our tackling is a disgrace.  Its been like this all year.  One does not need to kill a lad when he is coming through.  Hold him up, get up to speed beside him. TACKLE THE BALL.  
I worry for the standard of football in the county.  The club scene is dieing a death at the moment.  Would it not improve the club scene to let the county lads play more often and thus we might uncover new talent.  Guys who have the MATCH SKILLS to tackle, kick pass nad take score.  They can do this because they are doing it every weekend.
To look at the county team sometimes you would feel they never handled trained with the ball.  Sloppy kicking, catching, score taking..  list can go on.

Best post I've read on this current shambles.

Westfuckingmeath lads, let that sink in. And now here we are terrified of playing Offaly in our own back yard. Offaly!

It's no coincidence club football in Dublin is getting stronger along with their county team. It's dying on it's knees in Kildare but no one seems to care. And those who do were ignored last December.

To be blunt, county players think playing club football is beneath them, they strut around the place thinking they're fucking celebrities. Look at our minors, they aren't allowed play SFL games because they're still in the Leinster championship, what the hell have they been doing for the past 5 weeks? The whole mindset in this county needs to change or we're going nowhere fast.
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jimmers
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v westmeath   Thu Jun 30, 2016 9:45 am

"we're going nowhere fast"

We've actually arrived...
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SeamusMurphy
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v westmeath   Thu Jun 30, 2016 11:10 am

Next year we'll be terrified of drawing carlow or Wicklow away.  
Good point on the minors Taibi. . Don't forget the managers with egos.

How long is the current managers eh agreement? .
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jim
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v westmeath   Thu Jun 30, 2016 6:30 pm

[quote="SeamusMurphy"]Next year we'll be terrified of drawing carlow or Wicklow away.  
Good point on the minors Taibi. . Don't forget the managers with egos.

How long is the current managers eh agreement? .[/quote

You talk about the manager's ego Seamus but look at the supporters ego's your own included. An attitude like who are Westmeath or Offaly or Carlow sort of looking down our noses at them as if we have a god given right to be better then them.
Our attitude as a society has changed dramatically and its reflected in a lot clubs and county players and supporters. Its always someone else's fault. I see it in my own club too. Beaten in a championship and lads coming out of thr dressing room laughing. How can it not hurt?

Ask yourself this. Who was the best player you seen play for kildare and why? The why is the most important part. Why was he so good? What sets him above the average player ? Look at all his attributes . Then compair him to a current player and see the difference.
To me there lies a major part of our problem as a county. The manager has to take some of the blame as does the CB. But for me the guy who steps on to the stage is in charge of his own destiny.
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SeamusMurphy
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v westmeath   Thu Jun 30, 2016 9:11 pm

Jim I was alluding as to where we are now, and it's not looking like getting any better.. if my attitude offends you because I want to see us competing with and beating the top teams and not to be struggling against div 4 teams.

By the way the manager I was referring to wasn't cian, I should have been more clearer.
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jim
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v westmeath   Thu Jun 30, 2016 9:17 pm

Nothing wrong with wanting to compete against the top teams but its the way supporters dismiss other counties as if we're so much better.
As i say we all have egos, just that more and more of both players and supporters are sadly lacking in humillity
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overthebar
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v westmeath   Thu Jun 30, 2016 9:28 pm

I think the rule on the minors not been allowed play with their clubs is a Croke Park ruling. Hardly the managers fault there I would say. County board officials allowed that rule to be carried at last years congress
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Xavi
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v westmeath   Thu Jun 30, 2016 9:55 pm

Taibi wrote:
Botch wrote:
Lets face it.  We have a bunch of average footballers at county level.  They are being programmed to play systems that they cannot or not good enough to play.  We should go toe to toe with teams like westmeath and offaly and make switches appropriately.  ie help out on the danger players.  At times against westmeath we had 2 or 3 lads just standing in space defending.  We should of pushed right up and tackled.
On the other hand our tackling is a disgrace.  Its been like this all year.  One does not need to kill a lad when he is coming through.  Hold him up, get up to speed beside him. TACKLE THE BALL.  
I worry for the standard of football in the county.  The club scene is dieing a death at the moment.  Would it not improve the club scene to let the county lads play more often and thus we might uncover new talent.  Guys who have the MATCH SKILLS to tackle, kick pass nad take score.  They can do this because they are doing it every weekend.
To look at the county team sometimes you would feel they never handled trained with the ball.  Sloppy kicking, catching, score taking..  list can go on.

Best post I've read on this current shambles.

Westfuckingmeath lads, let that sink in. And now here we are terrified of playing Offaly in our own back yard. Offaly!

It's no coincidence club football in Dublin is getting stronger along with their county team. It's dying on it's knees in Kildare but no one seems to care. And those who do were ignored last December.

To be blunt, county players think playing club football is beneath them, they strut around the place thinking they're fucking celebrities. Look at our minors, they aren't allowed play SFL games because they're still in the Leinster championship, what the hell have they been doing for the past 5 weeks? The whole mindset in this county needs to change or we're going nowhere fast.

Agree Taibi. This is becoming a massive problem. But I think with the current squad at senior with the youbger players it has came from underage structures and development squads mentality building 13/14/15 year olds up to be celebs and creating a disconnect wIth their club and team mates.

The current Dublin team are for the most part superstars in the GAA world. The likes of Brogan , Connolly and Cuxton are known country wide and wouldn't have the mentality or mindset of some of our lads
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micky murphy
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v westmeath   Thu Jun 30, 2016 10:37 pm

Attitude in Kildare is all wrong at the moment players / county board and supporters, like all parties taught we were too good for Div 3 and we could be back there next year, then after watching the games v Clare and Wexford, all parties taught we were going to beat Westmeath for some reason which was crazy if you weren't looking at both game with the lily tinted glasses!!!

My hope at the start of this year was realistic and was to try and get back to being the 2nd best team in Leinster and I believed we had the right manager appointed to achieve this which was incorrect.

I still believe we have the players to achieve this goal in the near future but someone is going to have to realise that the only way we are going to achieve this is by stripping it right back to basics getting a bunch of players off their pedestals and back to 1st principals of leaving absolutely everything behind you on the field, tackling and harassing like mad and working hard for your scores, it won't be pretty but its a start and the likes of Donegal and even Dublin got back on track by doing it and building from there.

Nobody could tell me that if got the likes of Jim McGuinness in that we wouldn't be in a way better place - boils down to attitude.

Johnny Doyle left nothing behind him on the pitch in 95% of his appearances for Kildare and on most occasions had to be scraped off the pitch now it would be very had to say for 12-13 of our starting team in any game this year
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steviegenius
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v westmeath   Fri Jul 01, 2016 3:18 am

The one thing about Johnny Doyle is that he Enjoyed his football and wanted to win. Going on the last three games its the exact opposite.
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jim
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v westmeath   Fri Jul 01, 2016 3:44 am

Do people think that if the county players played every game with there clubs that what happened last Sunday wouldn't have happened? Its a genuine question.
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Crofter
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v westmeath   Fri Jul 01, 2016 6:14 am

SeamusMurphy wrote:
Crofter wrote:
Team the next day:

Rex

Jimmers
TommyO'Neill
Taibi

Kildare Blade
Kelf
OhTooBe

Murof
Stonecold

Xavi
Inexile
Celbridgelad

TommyONeill's Sister
Tommy Keegan
Ogie

(a few blow ins in true Micko/McGeeney tradition)

Can we do any worse?

That's shite crofter, I'm walking away.  I'm not doing waterboy again.

Had you down to drive the bus Seamus but so be it..
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lillyboy
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v westmeath   Fri Jul 01, 2016 6:55 am

@Jim I think some people do but most realise a balance needs to be found for the benefit of all parties. It's in the last 10 years that the availability has become a major issue and once 1 county go down a road and have a little success the majority will follow. Someone needs to take control of fixtures at national level but change is desperately difficult to push through.
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jim
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v westmeath   Fri Jul 01, 2016 7:23 am

lillyboy wrote:
@Jim I think some people do but most realise a balance needs to be found for the benefit of all parties. It's in the last 10 years that the availability has become a major issue and once 1 county go down a road and have a little success the majority will follow. Someone needs to take control of fixtures at national level but change is desperately difficult to push through.

So do you think that if the county players played more with the club that the kildare senior football team would be better? That my question and I'd be interested to hear wh8people think.
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lillyboy
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v westmeath   Fri Jul 01, 2016 7:29 am

I don't think they should or could play every game but I think it would help if they were available more than at the moment
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jim
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v westmeath   Fri Jul 01, 2016 7:53 am

Intresting lillyboy. I actually don't think it would help the county team. I know its the popular thing to say and everyone saying oh they should be with the clubs more. It would help the club alright but i don't think it would be any benifit to the county team.

Out of interest how many league games were the county tram available for this year so far ?
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lillyboy
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v westmeath   Fri Jul 01, 2016 7:58 am

I think it would help in the long term rather than the short term but managers are judged on what happens in the here and now.
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jim
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v westmeath   Fri Jul 01, 2016 8:06 am

Yes i agree with that and lets be honest a county manager has enough to worry about without worry about clubs.
How do you think it would help as a matter of intrest?
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lillyboy
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v westmeath   Fri Jul 01, 2016 8:18 am

I think there's a growing devide between club and county which will over time have a negative effect , clubs need the publicity a successful county teams bring as it generates interest among kids and the county needs a healthy club scene to have a supply of players. Clubs are primarily responsible for the production of players at the end of the day.
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jim
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v westmeath   Fri Jul 01, 2016 8:31 am

Its a good point . But if the county team is going well it drives everything from club to underage to fun raising.
I still dont think that having the county player playing for the club would improve the kildare team.
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Lily8
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PostSubject: Re: Kildare v westmeath   Fri Jul 01, 2016 8:54 am

It's hard to know. Personally I think it could improve things because the standard of club football would improve and it'd also give the county lads a break from training to play an actual match. The Monaghan lads play in most of their club league games and they seem to have it working pretty well.  It could also improve the relationship between the clubs and the county board but that's a long term thing.

However, no matter how much club football they play if the Kildare management persist with the defensive system that clearly isn't working for this panel of players, it's not going to make a difference how much club football they play or don't play. We'll still get performances like we saw on Sunday.
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