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 O'Byrne Cup 2017

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KFSAM
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PostSubject: Re: O'Byrne Cup 2017   Mon Jan 23, 2017 11:51 pm

A new low, beaten by Dublins 3rd team. Has to be said the state of football in the county is abysmal. County team is a laughing stock. The future is bleak as the county as a whole lacks any backbone. This can be seen the whole way through the structure that is kildare gaa. Cribben should have knocked every tooth out of that dublin lads head. Tell you now if a kildare lad did that to a dub that's exactly what would have happened.

There's no shame in loosing a game, but there is loosing to that dublin team the way they did.
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PostSubject: Re: O'Byrne Cup 2017   Tue Jan 24, 2017 12:10 am

Just to rub it in, Glen Ryan is on Laochra Gael tonight. Jesus you'd nearly think it was planned.
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PostSubject: Re: O'Byrne Cup 2017   Tue Jan 24, 2017 12:17 am

Brilliant – a reminder of days it looks increasingly unlikely any of us will ever see again in our lifetimes.
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PostSubject: Re: O'Byrne Cup 2017   Tue Jan 24, 2017 12:53 am

I think individually the players on the panel are pretty decent but collectively they are lacking in leadership, game management, nous and grit. Cant really teach these qualities but players can emerge from pack and hopefully we will see some of these qualities in the league. It is only January, remember.
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PostSubject: Re: O'Byrne Cup 2017   Tue Jan 24, 2017 1:18 am

When TK comes across as one of the more reasonable posters after a Kildare defeat, you know things are a bit mad!

Performance was bad, and awful in the last 20 minutes. Thing is I have seen enough of these terrible displays over the years from Kildare not to get too worked up about it. Even some of the so-called legends who apparently wouldn't have tolerated defeat were part of terrible Kildare performances. Before our last Leinster title, we lost at home to Fermanagh (when they were much worse than now), drew at home to Clare, lost to a mediocre Sligo team and were completely outplayed by an understrength Meath to seal relegation.

Not predicting a Leinster title but lets not pretend this was unchartered territory. I can still remember the loss to Limerick in the league in 1990.

Micko was great for getting players heads right for big games but there aren't many Mickos' out there now other than Brian Cody. O'Neill isn't going to belong to that category but he was right to say what he said after the game about the players performance. Jason Ryan never threw the players under the bus and it didn't do him much good. If the same players are making the same mistakes under 2 or more different managers, chances are its not the managers fault. Players need to be put under pressure to perform rather than people enabling them by making excuses for them by blaming the manager.

Eddie Jones said the essence of top-level sport was getting comfortable with being uncomfortable. Dublin have such depth that no one gets too comfortable. In Kerry, every year they don't win an all-ireland is failure. In other counties, particularly along the western sea-board, players have to spend so much time travelling and making sacrifices that being an inter-county footballer is not a comfortable existence. In Kildare, with little depth and not much travel or loss of earnings involved, our players have become comfortable with being comfortable. O'Neill knows it and is trying to change this.

If any of the players are reading this, ye could do worse than read this quote from Louth manager Colin Kelly.

"Listen, it’s a man’s game. Why work you ass off three or four nights a week to go out and go into yourself when the game starts on Sunday? What are you training for? It’s a physical game, we’re not over the top, we’re not physical in any fashion but what we don’t want is lads taking a backward step."

PS If John Fogarty, Kieran Shannon or Colm Keys are currently copying and pasting people's posts on this thread to repackage as an article on Kildare football tomorrow would ye kindly acknowledge where ye source ye're material from lads.
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Gaa1928
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PostSubject: Re: O'Byrne Cup 2017   Tue Jan 24, 2017 1:33 am

You can't really win can you.   We lost one or two 'hard men' this year who when they were playing 'hard' got dogs abuse on this forum. Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes
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murof
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PostSubject: Re: O'Byrne Cup 2017   Tue Jan 24, 2017 2:13 am

Gaa1928 wrote:
You can't really win can you.   We lost one or two 'hard men' this year who when they were playing 'hard' got dogs abuse on this forum. Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes
If you are referring to the 2 players I think you are they played the hard man stupidly and often got sent of leaving their team with a numerical didadvantage. They deserved criticism but not abuse. Cribben was right not to do likewise yesterday but should have found a way to get even at some later stage.
Mick Lyons and Colm O'Rourke both said many years ago that the best way to be physical was to get man and ball in a collision. Glen Ryan was the best in a white jersey to do that. Its hard to imagine any present Kildare player doing likewise sadly but its also hard to see them win in Navan by relying on "nice football".
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jim
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PostSubject: Re: O'Byrne Cup 2017   Tue Jan 24, 2017 2:17 am

Who are these hard man you speek off
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flourman
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PostSubject: Re: O'Byrne Cup 2017   Tue Jan 24, 2017 2:20 am

I assume Chalky and Flynn
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Gaa1928
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PostSubject: Re: O'Byrne Cup 2017   Tue Jan 24, 2017 2:36 am

Like I said your 'wrong if you do' and your 'wrong if you don't'. Shocked Shocked Shocked
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PostSubject: Re: O'Byrne Cup 2017   Tue Jan 24, 2017 3:39 am

TommyKeegan wrote:
Obviously wasn't there and maybe we are just that bad, but is it possible given it's our first team who've played four games in three weeks, that they wanted a week off before the league and threw it? Just saying, if I was a manager I wouldn't want my players with five games in a month heading into a huge league campaign.

Only been to one game - it was the first game. I asked Cian O'Neill about the ridiculous scenario of playing three games in eight days and in the extension of that discussion, he said the best-case scenario in the O'Byrne Cup was to reach the semi-final and lose, so as not to be playing seven days before the League, having played so many games up to that. You would also have gotten your college players back and gotten a game into them. Not saying they threw it, wasn't at it.

Anyway, while the phrase 'a new low' has been used many, many, many, many times on the forum since the 2012 quarter-final, I still reckon losing to Kilkenny in the O'Byrne Cup would be hard to beat
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TommyKeegan
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PostSubject: Re: O'Byrne Cup 2017   Tue Jan 24, 2017 6:02 am

flourman wrote:
TommyKeegan wrote:
Obviously wasn't there and maybe we are just that bad, but is it possible given it's our first team who've played four games in three weeks, that they wanted a week off before the league and threw it? Just saying, if I was a manager I wouldn't want my players with five games in a month heading into a huge league campaign.

You do make me laugh Ewan, you berated Jason Ryan, almost before a ball was kicked, under his tenure and then come out with this shite, I wonder what your reaction would be if a Jason Ryan managed Kildare were humiliated by Dublin's 3rd string?

No, I disliked the situation he took over in, and he couldn't win. That was a time where people like me talked about the work McGeeney had done and how high up the ladder we climbed while many here and in the county got greedy and couldn't see that his first team was done and he needed time to build a second one and that he'd been a major success in average county.

But not going to get deeper into all that again, even if time proved me and others completely correct and proved our predictions for the future to be hugely accurate and depressing. With Ryan it was a toxic takeover and he was never going to swim, was always going to sink. Even the players didn't want him after what happened. This though is an entirely different situation where an O'Byrne Cup game is being used to hammer a man who took over an average group of players just last season.

There may well be reason to go after O'Neill, there may be many of them, but can we at least have some patience for that, for instance until after 21 January!?!?! We're mad to hang a man before the trial here. Bloodthirsty stuff.
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PostSubject: Re: O'Byrne Cup 2017   Tue Jan 24, 2017 6:12 am

In fairness, neutral observers aren't exactly holding back in their assessment - O'Neill and the team getting it from all angles in papers today. I mean, it is genuine embarrassing stuff... Agree O'Neill has to be judged on league and championship, but having witnessed what I did yesterday, expectations decidedly modest.

Dubs supporters laughing their bollocks off at ourselves and Meath on way out... Don't blame them, both counties in free fall in recent years.
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PostSubject: Re: O'Byrne Cup 2017   Tue Jan 24, 2017 6:17 am

I doubt most Dublin supporters give the O'Byrne Cup much thought. Also laughing about Meath being a mess as seems to be opinion on here. Based on what? Ending their pre-season tour having won more than they lost and exiting a competition that doesn't matter in optimum time for one that does. When we won the O'Byrne Cup was it massive news out of curiosity and did we celebrate wildly because only such a reaction would justify this reaction to not winning it.
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PostSubject: Re: O'Byrne Cup 2017   Tue Jan 24, 2017 6:32 am

I wouldn't blame O'Neill for that yesterday. Players have to take responsibility at some stage. It wasn't O'Neill hitting shots from crazy angles when a man inside was in a better position, it wasn't O'Neill who can't pass the ball 35 yards under no pressure, it wasn't O'Neill who had free late on and lost the head and kicked it out for a sideline from the 45 line.
The old cliche of its up to the players when they cross the white line doesn't seem to get through to our lads. It's seems they are constantly waiting for someone else to do something. They need to grow up and start playing like men. Take responsibility and make something happen yourself.
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PostSubject: Re: O'Byrne Cup 2017   Tue Jan 24, 2017 6:35 am

Oh yeah, of course Dubs don't give a toss about O'Byrne Cup - or Leinster or the league at this stage. Just heard a few of them having a laugh about the fact both Kildare and Meath had been beaten on the way out. Totally offhand stuff but gives some insight into current standing of both counties.
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PostSubject: Re: O'Byrne Cup 2017   Tue Jan 24, 2017 6:42 am

Also agree pinning all the blame on O'Neill is totally unfair - Eoin Doyle aside, there does seem to be a chronic lack of leadership in this group.
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PostSubject: Re: O'Byrne Cup 2017   Tue Jan 24, 2017 6:42 am

TommyKeegan wrote:
I doubt most Dublin supporters give the O'Byrne Cup much thought. Also laughing about Meath being a mess as seems to be opinion on here. Based on what? Ending their pre-season tour having won more than they lost and exiting a competition that doesn't matter in optimum time for one that does. When we won the O'Byrne Cup was it massive news out of curiosity and did we celebrate wildly because only such a reaction would justify this reaction to not winning it.

Can't compare yesterday to previous years when we won the O'Byrne cup. In the years we won it we would have experimented a lot more than this year. It was obvious this year and also backed up by Cian O'Neills post games comments yesterday, that he wanted to win the game against a 3rd string Dublin team. Make no mistake it is extremely worrying going into the league in a fortnight.
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PostSubject: Re: O'Byrne Cup 2017   Tue Jan 24, 2017 6:48 am

Ah come on JJ how could you possibly infer O'Neill wanted to win from his post-match comments: "Disgusted... Shouldn't happen... Kildare teams do this too often."

Clearly didn't get Tommy's "just chill dude" memo! It seems apart from players, management, supporters and media, no one is too disappointed.
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PostSubject: Re: O'Byrne Cup 2017   Tue Jan 24, 2017 6:57 am

The way I look at it is as follows:

What is done is done, we only have to wait for 2 weeks for the beginning of the league so let's wait and see what happens in Navan on Sunday week and take things from there.

Going back to talking about previous managers etc at this stage is as waste of time, as i say, what's done is done.

I actually felt that this Dublin team would be no pushovers, what Dublin team are ? but I am very hopeful that we will kick off with a win in Navan.
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PostSubject: Re: O'Byrne Cup 2017   Tue Jan 24, 2017 7:02 am

It's true that if we have a good league campaign this will merely be another in the long line of debacles we have born witness to as Kildare fans. For what it's worth, I genuinely don't think I will ever see anything that eclipses Kerry 7-16 Kildare 0-10.

At least I hope to Christ I don't.
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PostSubject: Re: O'Byrne Cup 2017   Tue Jan 24, 2017 7:15 am

I suppose to be fair to this group of players, they usually respond well to a disappointing defeat - and there have been many of them in recent times. I think Tyrone in 2013 is the last time they've lost two consecutive championship games and it was Sligo in 2005 before that. Hopefully yesterday will light a fire under them and there's much more fight and urgency on display in Navan.
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PostSubject: Re: O'Byrne Cup 2017   Tue Jan 24, 2017 8:45 am

kickingking wrote:
I suppose to be fair to this group of players, they usually respond well to a disappointing defeat - and there have been many of them in recent times. I think Tyrone in 2013 is the last time they've lost two consecutive championship games and it was Sligo in 2005 before that. Hopefully yesterday will light a fire under them and there's much more fight and urgency on display in Navan.

We beat Louth the week before that Tyrone defeat so it's actually 2005 the last time we lost 2 championship games in a row.
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PostSubject: Re: O'Byrne Cup 2017   Tue Jan 24, 2017 9:22 am

HauntedGraffiti wrote:
Ah come on JJ how could you possibly infer O'Neill wanted to win from his post-match comments: "Disgusted... Shouldn't happen... Kildare teams do this too often."

Clearly didn't get Tommy's "just chill dude" memo! It seems apart from players, management, supporters and media, no one is too disappointed.

I couldn't disagree more. Even if we beat Meath in the 1st game. I'll be still disgusted with what I witnessed yesterday and anyone that I spoke to coming ot of Newbridge yesterday were the same....embarrassed.
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PostSubject: Re: O'Byrne Cup 2017   Tue Jan 24, 2017 9:29 am

Crofter wrote:
kickingking wrote:
I suppose to be fair to this group of players, they usually respond well to a disappointing defeat - and there have been many of them in recent times. I think Tyrone in 2013 is the last time they've lost two consecutive championship games and it was Sligo in 2005 before that. Hopefully yesterday will light a fire under them and there's much more fight and urgency on display in Navan.

We beat Louth the week before that Tyrone defeat so it's actually 2005 the last time we lost 2 championship games in a row.

Bouncebackability. Basketball
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