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 Leinster Final 2017

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Cassanata
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PostSubject: Re: Leinster Final 2017   Tue Jun 27, 2017 4:24 am

HauntedGraffiti wrote:
An amazing thing about Dublin is that Stephen Cluxton alone makes beating them a mathematical improbability for most teams.

He has a bit of a hot head at times and can be rattled. Would love to see a high ball coming in on him, let him have it and plant him with a hard but fair shoulder. I'd say there would be a good chance some Dublin player will react and be seeing red after it.
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PostSubject: Re: Leinster Final 2017   Tue Jun 27, 2017 7:52 am

I will ALWAYS harp back to Dublin v Fermanagh in 2015. I know they lost by 8 points, but in context that is not that bad.
The thing I loved that day was the fact that Quigley barged Cluxton over the line. Then laughed his hole off. Later Cluxton did an air kick and it fell to Corrigan who tapped in in front of the Hill and he rubbed it in.
Philly Mc had words and he told him to F off. Later Quigley slotted a free from way out and the Hill booed. Cluxton was rattled that day too.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GVRg_UBgXSw

I just wish we pissed them off a bit. Fermanagh lost but they annoyed them. When was the last time the Hill even bothered booing a Kildare player?!
Let's be pricks is the gist of what I am saying. I think we are a better team that Fermanagh and if we lost but messed them up a bit we would take something from it.
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PostSubject: Re: Leinster Final 2017   Tue Jun 27, 2017 2:26 pm

I think its time to get the flag out of the shed
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HauntedGraffiti
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PostSubject: Re: Leinster Final 2017   Tue Jun 27, 2017 10:27 pm

Some of the media analysis of Gavin's hissy fit hilarious, the likes of Oisin McConville, Mike Quirke and Ian O'Riordan trying to portray Gavin as some kind of Putin-esque Machiavellian mastermind. Get real lads. The much fabled "siege mentality" usually indicates some level of desperation and if that was part of Gavin's thinking, it was one of the more abysmal attempts I've seen. All it's done is create a media circus that plays nicely into our hands... Dubs also getting the usual fawning treatment in media. As Alan Brogan mentioned on Throw-In podcast, psychologically Kildare couldn't have asked for a better build-up to this game.
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kildaregaa365
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PostSubject: Re: Leinster Final 2017   Tue Jun 27, 2017 11:56 pm

Or alternatively HG, Gavin was desperate for anything he could do to ignite their season. I for one think that was the case and it worked. That said it does. Ring heaps of extra attention on them which is great for us.
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HauntedGraffiti
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PostSubject: Re: Leinster Final 2017   Wed Jun 28, 2017 12:11 am

I can see the point of view where he's thinking, right, I'll say this, get it off my chest and also light a fire under the team. If you have a legitimate grievance, I can see how you might go that route, although I'm not sure it would be my approach. In this instance, it definitely wouldn't. I really think the whole episode was just so utterly absurd that he hasn't achieved anything other than make himself and the team look very foolish and bring an avalanche of unwanted attention on them. That plus the constant ass-kissing they receive in the media is a toxic combination and if Dublin don't retain AI this season Gavin is going to get it from all angles.

That's why I totally disagree with Ian O'Riordan's analysis that it was a psychological masterclass (or something) – to me Gavin just looked like someone who was really annoyed and feeling the strain. Obviously doesn't guarantee us anything but I think it's a serious distraction for Dubs and we couldn't have asked for a better build-up. Their heads are going to be fried and they'll still be expected to win by 20 points. Anything less and there'll be even more questions and controversy about Gavin's approach.

To reiterate, not a guarantee of anything but for me, an unexpected bonus. You have to take those when they come along.
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HauntedGraffiti
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PostSubject: Re: Leinster Final 2017   Wed Jun 28, 2017 12:21 am

Funnily enough, I think it would suit the Dubs more this year if they were getting worse press. If there were a few high profile commentators saying they're over-rated, overhyped. Then Gavin could come out and say, we're being disrespected etc. That would really give them something to kick against. Unfortunately for Dubs, to me the press conference was simply a farce. At best a transparent and utterly limp attempt to make themselves out as victims. A total miscalculation and a debacle, really.
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PostSubject: Re: Leinster Final 2017   Wed Jun 28, 2017 12:28 am

You'd have to think that the Connolly affair will die down in the next week or so. Plenty of time for the media to focus on players who have returned from professional sports abroad like Flynn, Brophy and Feeley.
Will be very interesting to see how open the players are if lobbed a few grenades. Let's hope no one says anything silly which can be used as a headline by the Herald.
" yerra sure we are up against the best team in the country " has worked well for KERRY for decades!
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PostSubject: Re: Leinster Final 2017   Wed Jun 28, 2017 12:35 am

But this is the thing – I honestly think because of Gavin it's now going to keep going! He's just poured a canister of gasoline on the fire.

Meanwhile all O'Neill has to do is play it straight, and the players just say, we're playing the best team in the country, it's going to be exceptionally tough etc. We don't have to talk about Connolly at all because it's nothing to do with us.

So I have us well ahead in "phoney war"!
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sarsno1
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PostSubject: Re: Leinster Final 2017   Wed Jun 28, 2017 12:38 am

dead right murof

" ah sure westmeath beat us last year , we will enjoy the day out "
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Rex
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PostSubject: Re: Leinster Final 2017   Wed Jun 28, 2017 1:06 am

murof wrote:
You'd have to think that the Connolly affair will die down in the next week or so.  Plenty of time for the media to focus on players who have returned from professional sports abroad like Flynn,  Brophy and Feeley.
Will be very interesting to see how open the players are if lobbed a few grenades. Let's hope no one says anything silly which can be used as a headline by the Herald.
" yerra sure we are up against the best team in the country " has worked well for KERRY for decades!  

As it's turned out that's the best way forward. Just keep pushing everything back to Dublin.

How will you compete "sure their the best team in the country we are just delighted to be in a Leinster final."

Will you target their kickouts "sure Cluxton is the best keeper in the Country, we'll do our best. We are just delighted to be in a final."

Will you play defensive or your natural game "sure we are playing the best team in the Country we'll play as we see fit. We are just happy to be getting an opportunity."

Also as murof has mentioned there has been a lot of chatter from pundits about the professional players we apparently have Didn't bother all these pundits when our underage teams were getting pulled apart by the Kerry man. Now they're back they are professionals.

Only one team in the Leinster final have professionals and they are not wearing white.
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PostSubject: Re: Leinster Final 2017   Wed Jun 28, 2017 1:29 am

That's the thing. It's hardly lipservice from our side to say that we are facing a huge challenge against one of the best sides ever. It's the truth -Cian can genuinely say that.

Also as noted Connolly and the media will be dragged up, but it's not for us to comment on the Dubs. They will have to deal with all that shite they brought upon themselves.
Just had a quick look and there are 90 online articles that hit Diarmuid Connolly on Monday and today. Jim Gavin created that.
Prior to the game he was mentioned only in passing as to who would step up in his absence. The lad himself is hardly too pleased either...
I am sure it's a notion that it will do something but with all their partners taking on the media is hardly what they want.

Doubt it will derail anything but we are even less of a story now, which must suit the lads.
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PostSubject: Re: Leinster Final 2017   Wed Jun 28, 2017 1:59 am

I really do think it's hilarious the way Jim Gavin – the most boring man in the GAA, possibly world sport – has attempted to reinvent himself as a poor man's Jose Mourinho or Alex Ferguson. Deeply unconvincing performance. All he's succeeded in doing is making himself and the team look like complete gobshites.

If you listen to the Throw-In Podcast, Ciaran Whelan and Alan Brogan very uncomfortable with it. Brogan says the whole weekend will suit Kildare and Whelan saying the whole episode doing Dublin GAA no favours. The week leading into the game, all the talk will be, how will the Dubs be affected by the Connolly saga? Was Gavin right or wrong? Will the gamble pay off, is this the season it finally unravels etc etc. You can see it seeping into the camp and if we can keep this game tight in the first half, might just start planting one or two seeds of doubt in their heads.
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PostSubject: Re: Leinster Final 2017   Wed Jun 28, 2017 6:18 am

I don't think this Connolly saga is going to die down at all. It has already started and is likely to intensify over the next few weeks.

In some ways it's amusing. Perhaps we will have a Free the Marino One campaign, or maybe the Dublin fans will get up and leave their seats on the 12th minute as an act of solidarity for their fallen hero?

Or perhaps they'll retire his jersey!

On a serious note, the strongest and most powerful team have shown they have a problem with respecting the authority of the disciplinary bodies of the association. Did Connolly interfere with the linesman, obviously yes. Where they entitled to look into it? Again, obviously yes. It seemed a no brainer to me, as in any sport, if the authority of the officials is undermined then it spells major trouble. They had to act.

However, Will a referee have the bottle to show a Dublin player a black or red card from here on? Referees have a habit of balancing out decisions in matches but might they do that with the Dubs,?

There could be 60,000 baying Dubs there in a few weeks waiting to be offended by a decision of an official. The pressure will be on the officials and they may buckle. We will be the ones who will suffer if that happens.

I don't think Galvin is that clever to have fully thought it through. I think he was mimicking Mourinho etc., and that's pretty cheap.

However it does show that they feel they are above the rules and I believe it has placed undesirable pressure on future match officials. That's sinister.
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PostSubject: Re: Leinster Final 2017   Wed Jun 28, 2017 6:28 am

I definitely would not bring the cleverness of Gavin into the equation. He is so methodical that it wasn't a throw-away, but I think this feels like something someone convinced him to do as it is very removed from his usual MO.
It feels like him following bad advice, but maybe he is seeing something he doesn't like inside the camp and he wants to take some heat.
It suits us but this is not about a Leinster Final, it is about Kerry and the likes further down the line.

As I said that is their business so we have to just make sure we are fully focused and ready to rumble.
When I think about this game I turn into the aul lad down the local pitch who roars to put a lad over the sideline with a shoulder is any player is within ten metres of the sideline. It rarely happens but we need a bit of that.
As I said let's be pricks. We will still be considered sound in comparison to the Dubs! Laughing
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HauntedGraffiti
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PostSubject: Re: Leinster Final 2017   Wed Jun 28, 2017 6:32 am

Fizzer wrote:
maybe the Dublin fans will get up and leave their seats on the 12th minute as an act of solidarity for their fallen hero?

Or perhaps they'll retire his jersey!


lol!

And maybe U2 will dedicate a song to him in Croker the week after!!

Btw, very good point about possible black and red cards, etc. This is one area where Gavin's outburst could benefit Dublin. In a close game, it's the easiest thing in the world for refs to lean towards Dublin because of their power and status in the association, as well as their influence in the media.

It quite possibly cost Mayo the All Ireland last year with Keegan's black card. We had the same situation ourselves with Bernard Brogan's Swan Lake audition in 2011 and Cormac Reilly's genuinely moving concern for his welfare.

We'll definitely need a strong ref for this one.
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PostSubject: Re: Leinster Final 2017   Wed Jun 28, 2017 6:34 am

Flamingo wrote:
He is so methodical that it wasn't a throw-away, but I think this feels like something someone convinced him to do as it is very removed from his usual MO.
It feels like him following bad advice, but maybe he is seeing something he doesn't like inside the camp and he wants to take some heat.

Almost certainly the case.
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PostSubject: Re: Leinster Final 2017   Wed Jun 28, 2017 6:45 am

Forget Ferguson or Mourinho - to me Gavin looked more like Kevin Keegan in 96!! A man under real pressure.
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PostSubject: Re: Leinster Final 2017   Wed Jun 28, 2017 7:13 am

Lads this is so funny, I just have to put it up. It's from the current Phoenix magazine...

The Which-Attack Linesman
(with apologies to Glen Campbell)

I am a lineman in Carlow county
But Down is my home
And if Diarmuid Connolly wants to attack me
Let him come

The Dubs want him more than need him
Now they won't have him for some time
My name's Ciaran Brannigan
And I still run the line

Doodle, doodle, doo!
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PostSubject: Re: Leinster Final 2017   Wed Jun 28, 2017 6:35 pm

The only benefit I see in this for Kildare is that the spotlight is off them now after the hype had gone a bit mad - not necessarily among supporters but in the media - after beating Laois and Meath so well. It was as if these were teams on a par or not far off Dublin and there was going to be a degree of expectation going into the All-Ireland final. That is still there, for supporters and the players/management, but it's more realistic I think. Not having that external pressure is very welcome for this squad right now.

The other thing that helped in that regard is Sunday's game. Suddenly analysis is that the Dubs were incredible, even while the same analysis might say that Westmeath were naive. We learned nothing new. It was a good reminder though. Don't ask them questions and you're dead.

I don't see the kerfuffle having any negative impact on the Dublin players though. They are a long time on the road. Seems to me like Gavin might be trying to galvanise them, having maybe seen a little regression in hunger or intensity or whatever. And what's being said about him won't bother Gavin or the players.

But overall, the last few days have been good for Kildare. I still think they're very much up against it but hope they ask big questions and can take something into the next day. Well, I hope they win, but that's what I'm looking for because recent comments here again are a reminder that heavy beatings in big games will have you rendered a laughing stock, regardless of what else you've done.
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PostSubject: Re: Leinster Final 2017   Wed Jun 28, 2017 9:00 pm

All fair points Ogie, although I would disagree with you on the negative impact on Dublin. As I said, I really thought Gavin came across as someone who was losing the plot a bit, and I think this whole saga is getting inside their heads.

For good measure, there is yet more coverage in the Irish Times again today; Kevin Walsh shooting his mouth off about it, Sean Moran giving his view etc etc. In the week before the game, it will be dredged up once more. It is a big distraction for Dublin squad as it is a huge talking point among sports media and sports followers here, and there is simply no way for them to avoid it. And all due to the psychological "genius" of Jim Gavin!

Meanwhile, Kildare have drifted totally into the background and will be completely written off. An ideal way to come in, totally under the radar.
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PostSubject: Re: Leinster Final 2017   Wed Jun 28, 2017 10:13 pm

This place has turned into Dublin gaa forum over last few days
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PostSubject: Re: Leinster Final 2017   Wed Jun 28, 2017 10:27 pm

Er, no, don't think it has.
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PostSubject: Re: Leinster Final 2017   Wed Jun 28, 2017 10:38 pm

HauntedGraffiti wrote:
All fair points Ogie, although I would disagree with you on the negative impact on Dublin. As I said, I really thought Gavin came across as someone who was losing the plot a bit, and I think this whole saga is getting inside their heads.

They've just beaten a team by 31 points, you're clutching at straws if you think this saga is going to impact proceedings on the 16th in anyway, shape or form.
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PostSubject: Re: Leinster Final 2017   Wed Jun 28, 2017 10:44 pm

flourman wrote:
HauntedGraffiti wrote:
All fair points Ogie, although I would disagree with you on the negative impact on Dublin. As I said, I really thought Gavin came across as someone who was losing the plot a bit, and I think this whole saga is getting inside their heads.

They've just beaten a team by 31 points, you're clutching at straws if you think this saga is going to impact proceedings on the 16th in anyway, shape or form.

+1

The whole thing is a bit of a storm in a teacup. Gavin's stunt is only going to give plenty of fodder for the hacks in the papers and the talking heads on tv/radio to feed on for the next few weeks. It will have minimal impact on the field of play.
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